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Miscellaneous comments and questions

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1 Miscellaneous comments and questions on Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:11 am

I love this project! Keep up the good work everyone. I found you through David Ng's final Boing Boing post and have been obsessing about Phylo ever since. I've got a list of questions, suggestions and comments and rather than create a bunch of new threads, I thought I'd just dump them all in here. Sorry about the Wall of Text!

Questions:

  • Does the card background color signify anything?
  • Does the order of the Terrain icons at the bottom of the card matter?


Suggestions:

  • I think kids (and teachers) will be curious to know how to pronounce the scientific species names and classifications. It would be cool to link to sound files or pronunciation guides.
  • You should automate the twitter feed so it updates automatically when you post a new card. The latest post is a month old.
  • Someone commented in the thread about the card back graphics that the logo on the back would be important so observers could identify the game. Why not print a dedicated info card containing a brief synopsis of the game which people could hand them out to interested onlookers? It could even mimic the standard card layout:

Common Name: Phylo
Latin Name: "The biodiversity CCG" (or other short description)
Image: A graphic incorporating the Phylo logo.
Classification: (something clever)
Special Abilities: A longer description of the game/project.
Terrain: Urban,Forest,Ocean
Artist URL: http://phylogame.org

Observations:

I've never played a CCG before, and I was curious about the homogeneity of the Species cards. It seems like there are a lot of interchangable cards, and I was wondering why I would choose a Red Panda over a Rabbit or something (top of the head example, please don't analyze it Smile. Seems like many cards don't have an individual appeal (beyond the artwork, which I love.) I wanted to be able to compare cards so I made a CSV with the essential stats of each card this evening. (While I was at it I made a bunch of comments on individual cards on the phylo website. It also seems like classification for plants could use a review, but I didn't dig too deeply into it, not being a botanist or systematist.)

Looking through the card data, I did find a good deal of duplication, which surprised me because I'd assumed in a trading card type game you'd try to give each card a unique appeal.

Anyway it seems like due to the nature of the stats on the cards it's difficult to make them diverse because 1. card stats encode real life traits, 2. you need to keep things pretty simple, and 3. a lot of the traits chain together creating common combinations and restricting diversity (you can't give a carnivore a foodchain value of 1 or 2, and primary producers are either photosynthetic or molecular carbon users, etc.)

The summary being: Basic card stats don't provide enough diversity to make individual Species cards unique enough. I think more use of unique special abilities would help give Species cards an individual appeal.

I'll post my full csv file below, but here are a few examples of duplicated stats

Muskox and Ibex are functionally interchangable:

8,H,2,TTT,12,M2,7,"Capra ibex",Ibex,Mammalia
8,H,2,TTT,12,M2,7,"Ovibos moschatus",Muskox,Mammalia

Trees:

9,P,1,FFF,23,S1W,5,"Betula papyrifera","Paper Birch",Fagales
9,P,1,FFF,23,S1W,5,"Quercus lobata","Valley Oak",Magnoliopsida

Ocean:

4,C,3,OOO,23,M1,10,"Dendronotus frondosus","Dendronotus frondosus",Gastropoda
4,C,3,OOO,23,M1,10,"Facelina auriculata","Facelina auriculata",Gastropoda

and

5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Euprymna tasmanica","Southern Dumpling Squid",Cephalopoda,S
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Forcipiger flavissimus","Long Nosed Butterfly Fish",Actinopterygii
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Phycodurus eques","Leafy Sea Dragon",Actinopterygii
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Sepioloidea lineolata","Striped Pyjama Squid",Cephalopoda
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Tetrosomus gibbosus","Humpback Turretfish",Actinopterygii

Ocean is hard because a lot of the diversity in other groups is due to habitat. However, note above that the Southern Dumpling Squid has a Special Ability (the S at the end, I'll provide a key and column headings below) which uniquifies it.

Birds:

5,H,2,FGU,23,F2,4,"Phrrhula pyrrhula",Bullfinch,Aves
5,H,2,FGU,23,F2,4,"Tyrannus tyrannus","Eastern Kingbird",Aves

5,O,3,FFU,23,F2,4,"Carduelis carduelis","European Goldfinch",Aves
5,O,3,FFU,23,F2,4,"Poecile atricapillus","Black-capped Chickadee",Aves


Etc.

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2 Full CSV on Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:24 am

Here's the card data in CSV. The column names are self explanatory. The encoding should be pretty easy to discern but here's the key:


  • Size, Chain and Score are just as they are on the card.
  • Diet is the first letter of the Diets: PMHOC.
  • Terrain is the first letter of the Terrains with F(reshwater) changed to P(ond) for disambiguation with F(orest): DFGOPTU
  • Climate is 1234, cold, cool, warm, hot respectively.
  • Move, Flight, Spread = MFS with number. Spread uses Pollinator, Wind, Herbivore, Omnivore modifiers.
  • Order is the last part of the Classification. (Unique enough and saves typing)
  • Special? is a flag indicating special abilities/restrictions on the Species.


I hope folks find this useful or at least entertaining! Smile Please forgive any errors/omissions/typos.

Code:

Size,Diet,Chain,Terrain,Climate,Move/Flight/Spread,Points,Latin Name,Common Name,Order,Special?
5,C,3,GGG,34,M2,10,"Psammophis angolensis","Dwarf Sand Snake",Reptilia
7,O,3,FGG,23,M2,5,"Cerdocyon thous","Crab-eating Fox",Mammalia
5,H,2,FFF,3,F2,7,"Paradisaea rudolphi","Blue Bird-of-paradise",Aves
6,O,3,OOO,23,M2,6,"Limulus polyphemus","Atlantic Horseshoe Crab",Merostomata,S
5,O,3,FGG,34,M2,5,"Galago senegalensis","Lesser Bushbaby",Mammalia
6,O,3,TTT,23,F2,6,"Lagopus muta","Rock Ptarmigan",Aves
8,H,2,FPT,12,M2,5,"Alces alces","Moose",Mammalia
5,H,2,FFF,23,F2,5,"Bombycilla garrulus","Bohemian Waxwing",Aves
5,H,2,DDD,234,M2,6,"Euchoreutes naso","Long-eared Jeroba",Mammalia
6,H,2,FFF,34,F2,6,"Amazona albifrons","White-fronted Amazon"Aves
6,H,2,FFF,34,F2,6,"Ophisthocomus hoazin","Hoatzin",Aves
7,O,3,DFG,23,M2,4,"Nasua narica","White-nosed Coati",Mammalia
8,P,1,DDD,4,S1P,6,"Ferocactus cylindraceus","California Barrel Cactus",Eudicots
5,O,3,FFU,23,F2,4,"Carduelis carduelis","European Goldfinch",Aves
6,H,2,FFG,3,M2,7,"Nesolagus timminsi","Annamite Striped Rabbit",Mammalia
3,M,1,OPP,12,M0.5,4,"Hypsibius dujardini","Hypsibius dujardini",Eutardigrada
8,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Enteroctopus dofleini","North Pacific Giant Octopus",Cephalopoda
5,O,3,DDD,34,F2,5,"Camphylorhynchus brunneicapillus","Cactus Wren",Aves
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Forcipiger flavissimus","Long Nosed Butterfly Fish",Actinopterygii
4,O,3,FGO,23,M1,5,"Pagurus armatus","Black-eyed Hermit Crab",Crustacea,S
5,H,2,FGP,23,M2,5,"Fulica atra","Eurasian Coot",Aves
7,C,3,FGT,123,M2,7,"Canis lupus","Gray Wolf",Mammalia
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Tetrosomus gibbosus","Humpback Turretfish",Actinopterygii
9,P,1,FFF,34,S1P,5,"Plumeria obtusa",Frangipani,Magnoliopsida
7,C,3,FFG,23,M2,9,"Lynx lynx","Eurasian Lynx",Mammalia
7,P,1,FFU,23,S1HO,4,"Rubus ursinus",Blackberry,Magnoliopsida
5,P,1,OOO,23,S1,5,"Nereocystis luetkeana","Bull Kelp",Phaeophyceae
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Phycodurus eques","Leafy Sea Dragon",Actinopterygii
8,H,2,TTT,12,M2,7,"Capra ibex",Ibex,Mammalia
4,C,3,OOO,23,M1,10,"Facelina auriculata","Facelina auriculata",Gastropoda
7,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Ranzania laevis","Slender Sunfish",Actinopterygii
7,C,3,GPT,23,M2,8,"Leptailurus serval",Serval,Mammalia
4,C,3,OOO,23,M1,10,"Dendronotus frondosus","Dendronotus frondosus",Gastropoda
5,O,3,FFF,23,F2,5,"Pharomachrus mocinno","Resplendant Quetzal",Aves
5,P,1,FFG,23,S1P,4,"Rudbeckia hirta","Blackeyed Susan",Magnoliopsida
6,O,3,FFF,34,M2,6,"Leontopithecus rosalia","Golden Lion Tamarin",Mammalia
4,C,3,UUU,23,M2,10,"Araneus diadematus","European Garden Spider",Arachnida,S
6,H,2,FGP,23,M2,5,"Castor canadensis","North American Beaver",Mammalia
5,C,3,FGO,12,M0.5,9,"Pisaster ochraceus","Ochre Sea Star",Asteroidea,S
5,H,2,FGU,23,F2,4,"Tyrannus tyrannus","Eastern Kingbird",Aves
6,P,1,FGU,23,S1P,3,"Ipomoea pandurata","Big-rooted Morning Glory",Magnoliopsida
5,P,1,FGG,34,S1P,4,"Nepenthes gymnamphora","Nepenthes gymnamphora",Magnoliopsida,S
7,C,3,FOT,12,M2,8,"Phoca vitulina","Harbor Seal",Mammalia
1,M,1,UUU,23,,6,"Virus subtype H1N1","Influenza A",Orthomyxoviridae,S
5,C,3,OOO,12,M2,10,"Himantolophus groenlandicus","Atlantic Footballfish",Actinopterygii,S
6,C,3,OOO,12,M2,10,"Neoraja caerulea","Blue Ray",Chondrichthyes
9,P,1,FFF,23,S1W,5,"Betula papyrifera","Paper Birch",Fagales
6,H,2,FFG,23,M2,6,"Spilogale putorius","Eastern Spotted Skunk",Mammalia
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Sepioloidea lineolata","Striped Pyjama Squid",Cephalopoda
7,P,1,FGU,23,S1P,3,"Helianthus annuus",Sunflower,Asteraceae
6,O,3,OOO,3,M2,10,"Holacanthus ciliaris","Queen Angelfish",Actinopterygii
5,C,3,OOO,12,M2,10,"Grimpoteuthis","Dumbo Octopus",Cephalopoda
8,H,2,DGT,12,M2,5,"Ovis canadensis","Bighorn Sheep",Mammalia
2,M,1,PPP,23,S1,5,"Paramecium aurelia","Paramecium aurelia",Ciliophora
4,H,2,FGU,23,M2,5,"Danaus plexippus","Monarch Butterfly",Insecta,S
7,C,3,DGT,23,M2,8,"Caracal caracal",Caracal,Mammalia
6,O,3,GGT,34,M2,5,"Suricata suricatta",Meerkat,Mammalia
1,M,1,UUU,23,,6,"Human immunodeficiency virus","HIV-I",Retroviridae,S
5,O,3,FGU,23,F2,5,"Turdus philomelos","Song Thrush",Aves
4,C,3,FGU,23,M2,6,"Soccinella septempunctata","Seven-spot Ladybird",Insecta,S
8,C,4,OTT,1,M2,12,"Ursus maritimus","Polar Bear",Mammalia,S
5,P,1,OOO,23,S0.5,5,"Caulerpa peltata","Caulerpa peltata",Bryopsidophyceae
9,O,3,FGU,123,M1,,"Kashyyyk kashyyyk",Wookiee,Mammalia,S
2,M,1,FPU,123,S1,2,"Escherichia coli","Escherichia coli","Gammaproteobacteria",S
1,M,1,PPP,23,,6,"Lambda phage-coliphage lambda","Enterobacteria phage lambda",Caudovirales,S
5,P,1,PPP,12,S0.5,5,"Thamnobryum alopecurum","Fox-tail Feather Moss",Bryopsida
5,O,3,FGU,23,M2,4,"Mus musculus","Common House Mouse",Mammalia,S
6,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Cypselurus californicus","California Flying Fish",Actinopterygii
6,O,3,DDD,34,M2,6,"Vulpes zerda","Fennec Fox",Mammalia
8,O,3,OOO,12,M3,6,"Thunnus thynnus","Northern Blue Fin Tuna",Actinopterygii
6,O,3,FFF,34,M2,6,"Saguinus oedipus","Cottontop Tamarin",Mammalia
4,H,2,FGG,34,F2,5,"Spoladea recurvalis","Hawaiian Beet Webworm",Insecta,S
9,P,1,FFF,23,S1P,5,"Cornus nuttallii","Pacific Dogwood",Eudicots
5,O,3,FGU,123,F2,2,"Erithacus rubecula","European Robin",Aves
6,O,3,FGU,1234,F2,2,"Corvus corax","Common Raven",Aves,S
6,C,3,FFG,34,M2,9,"Dasyurus maculatus","Tiger Quoll",Mammalia
6,H,2,FFF,34,F2,6,"Pteropus conspicillatus","Spectacled Fruit Bat",Mammalia,S
6,C,3,DFF,34,F2,8,"Myzopoda schliemanni","Western Sucker-footed Bat",Mammalia
5,C,3,FGP,34,F2,7,"Lavia frons","Yellow-winged Bat",Mammalia
5,H,2,FFF,34,F2,6,"Artibeus jamaicensis","Jamaican Fruit Bat",Mammalia,S
6,P,1,UUU,34,S1P,5,"Hibiscus rosa-sinensis","Chinese Hibiscus",Eudicots
7,H,2,FGP,4,F2,5,"Hypsignathus monstrosus","Hammer-headed Bat",Mammalia
7,C,3,DGT,34,M2,8,"Canis lupus dingo",Dingo,Mammalia,S
5,H,2,FGU,23,F2,4,"Phrrhula pyrrhula",Bullfinch,Aves
5,O,3,GPU,23,F2,3,"Agelaius phoeniceus","Red-winged Blackbird",Aves
6,P,1,FGT,23,S1P,3,"Mitella pentandra","Alpine Mitrewort",Magnoliopsida
7,O,3,DGG,34,M2,5,"Hyaena hyaena","Striped Hyena",Mammalia,S
6,O,3,FGU,23,M2,4,"Meles meles","European Badger",Mammalia
6,C,3,FFP,34,M2,9,"Salamandra salamandra","Fire Salamander",Amphibia
4,C,3,FGU,34,M2,8,"Phidippus audax","Bold Jumping Spider",Arachnida,S
8,C,3,FGP,34,M2,8,"Boa constrictor","Boa Constrictor",Reptilia
5,O,3,FFU,23,F2,4,"Poecile atricapillus","Black-capped Chickadee",Aves
5,C,3,OOO,1,M2,11,"Chauliodus macouni","Pacific Viperfish",Actinopterygii
5,M,1,FFF,23,,5,"Amanita muscaria","Fly Agaric",Agaricomycetes,S
6,H,2,FGT,23,M1,6,"Strigops habroptila",Kikapo,Aves
4,H,2,FFF,23,M2,7,"Cerambyx cerdo","Great Capricorn Beetle",Insecta,S
5,O,3,FFU,23,M2,5,"Sciurus vulgaris","Eurasian Red Squirrel",Mammalia
5,C,3,FFF,23,F2,9,"Aegolius acadicus","Northern Saw-whet Owl",Aves
7,P,1,GGG,123,S1P,2,"Cirsium vulgare","Bull Thistle",Eudicots,S
8,P,1,FFG,23,S1P,4,"Oemleria cerasiformis","Indian Plum",Magnoliopsida
6,C,3,OOP,12,M3,8,"Oncorhynchus mykiss","Rainbow Trout",Actinopterygii,S
5,H,2,FFF,23,F2,6,"Cardinalis cardinalis","Northern Cardinal",Aves
4,O,3,FGT,23,M2,4,"Camponotus pennsylvanicus","Black Carpenter Ant",Insecta,S
6,O,3,GTT,12,M2,5,"Alopex lagopus","Arctic Fox",Mammalia
9,P,1,FFF,23,S1W,5,"Quercus lobata","Valley Oak",Magnoliopsida
5,C,3,OOO,2,M2,11,"Histioteuthis sp.","Cock Eyed Squid",Cephalopoda
6,C,3,GPP,23,F2,8,"Ardea herodias","Great Blue Heron",Aves
7,H,2,GGG,23,M2,7,"Equus ferus caballus",Horse,Mammalia
5,O,3,FGU,123,F2,1,"Sturnus vulgaris","European Starling",Aves,S
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Euprymna tasmanica","Southern Dumpling Squid",Cephalopoda,S
8,C,4,DGG,34,M2,11,"Panthero leo",Lion,Mammalia
6,C,3,OOO,3,M2,11,"Sepia latimanus","Broadclub Cuttlefish",Cephalopoda
5,O,3,GGG,34,F2,5,"Cosmopsarus regius","Royal Starling",Aves
5,H,2,FGU,23,F3,2,"Columba livia","Rock Pigeon",Aves,S
8,H,2,TTT,12,M2,7,"Ovibos moschatus",Muskox,Mammalia
1,M,1,PPP,23,,6,"T4 phage","Enterobacteria phage T4",Caudovirales,S
5,H,2,FGU,123,F2,2,"Passer domesticus","House Sparrow",Aves,S
4,C,3,OOO,3,M2,11,"Euprymna scolopes","Hawaiian Bobtail Squid",Cephalopoda,S
5,O,3,FFF,34,M2,6,"Phelsuma madagascariensis grandis","Madagascar Giant Day Gecko",Reptilia
9,P,1,FFF,23,S1,5,"Populus tremuloides","Trembling Aspen",Magnoliopsida
7,H,2,FFF,34,M1,7,"Bradypus variegatus","Brown Throated Sloth",Mammalia
5,P,1,FGU,34,S1P,1,"Impatiens glandulifera","Policeman's Helmet",Eudicots,S
6,O,4,DFG,23,M2,4,"Bassariscus astutus",Ringtail,Mammalia
5,H,2,FFU,123,F2,4,"Troglodytes troglodytes","Winter Wren",Aves
4,H,2,FGU,34,M2,5,"Apis mellifera","European Honey Bee",Insecta,S
8,H,2,GGG,34,M2,7,"Ceratotherium simum","White Rhinoceros",Mammalia
5,H,2,OOO,3,M2,8,"Pteropogon kauderni","Banggai Cardinal",Actinopterygii
6,O,3,FGT,123,M2,3,"Vulpes vulpes","Red Fox",Mammalia,S
6,O,3,FGU,123,M2,3,"Mephitis mephitis","Striped Skunk",Mammalia
6,O,3,FGU,123,M2,1,"Procyon lotor",Raccoon,Mammalia,S
5,O,3,OOT,1,M2,6,"Pygoscelis adeliae","Adelie Penguin",Aves
9,P,1,FFU,123,S1W,3,"Thuja plicata","Western Red Cedar",Pinopsida
6,O,3,OOO,23,M2,6,"Octopus maorum","Maori Octopus",Cephalopoda
5,O,3,FFF,34,M2,6,"Chamaeleo calyptratus","Veiled Chamelion",Reptilia
5,P,1,FGG,123,S1P,3,"Rosa nutkana","Nootka Rose",Magnoliopsida
6,O,3,GGG,23,M2,6,"Ailurus fulgens","Red Panda",Mammalia
5,H,2,FFG,23,F2,5,"Archilochus colubris","Ruby-throated Hummingbird",Aves

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3 wowza on Thu Sep 09, 2010 3:39 pm

that is a great analysis! this game has the potential to develop worldwide, and its stuff like this that will get it there! to make the game dynamic the cards will have to be different and collectable.

i think some interchangeability will be okay, especially in the base decks; at first people will be learning the concept and simple strategy, but as more cards are available to collect from NGOs etc, they can be given special effects.

Imagine visiting an exhibit on serotiny and getting a Saw Banksia card that spreads during a wildfire while other cards must be withdrawn!

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4 Re: Miscellaneous comments and questions on Sun Oct 23, 2016 4:33 am

dcb wrote:
I'll post my full csv file below, but here are a few examples of duplicated stats

Muskox and Ibex are functionally interchangable:

8,H,2,TTT,12,M2,7,"Capra ibex",Ibex,Mammalia
8,H,2,TTT,12,M2,7,"Ovibos moschatus",Muskox,Mammalia

Trees:

9,P,1,FFF,23,S1W,5,"Betula papyrifera","Paper Birch",Fagales
9,P,1,FFF,23,S1W,5,"Quercus lobata","Valley Oak",Magnoliopsida

Ocean:

4,C,3,OOO,23,M1,10,"Dendronotus frondosus","Dendronotus frondosus",Gastropoda
4,C,3,OOO,23,M1,10,"Facelina auriculata","Facelina auriculata",Gastropoda

and

5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Euprymna tasmanica","Southern Dumpling Squid",Cephalopoda,S
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Forcipiger flavissimus","Long Nosed Butterfly Fish",Actinopterygii
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Phycodurus eques","Leafy Sea Dragon",Actinopterygii
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Sepioloidea lineolata","Striped Pyjama Squid",Cephalopoda
5,C,3,OOO,23,M2,10,"Tetrosomus gibbosus","Humpback Turretfish",Actinopterygii

Ocean is hard because a lot of the diversity in other groups is due to habitat. However, note above that the Southern Dumpling Squid has a Special Ability (the S at the end, I'll provide a key and column headings below) which uniquifies it.

Birds:

5,H,2,FGU,23,F2,4,"Phrrhula pyrrhula",Bullfinch,Aves
5,H,2,FGU,23,F2,4,"Tyrannus tyrannus","Eastern Kingbird",Aves

5,O,3,FFU,23,F2,4,"Carduelis carduelis","European Goldfinch",Aves
5,O,3,FFU,23,F2,4,"Poecile atricapillus","Black-capped Chickadee",Aves


Etc.

Somehow this post reminds me to Yu-Gi-Oh! where it has a pair of cards with identical stats. They are Silver Fang and Wolf. Both have EARTH attribute, Beast-type, 4 levels, 1200 ATK, and 800 DEF. However, in the games Silver Fang is more expensive than Wolf because it is a Fusion material while Wolf is not.

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